>> CATHY: TUESDAY WAS THE INTERNATIONAL TRANSGENDER DAY OF VISIBILITY.

IT WAS ALSO THE DAY THE U.S.

SUPREME COURT STRUCK DOWN A COLORADO LAW BANNING LGBTQ CONVERSION THERAPY FOR MINORS, WHICH OPENS THE DOOR FOR THE PRACTICE TO RESUME IN MINNESOTA, JUST THREE YEARS AFTER IT WAS OUTLAWED HERE.

D.F.L.

REPRESENTATIVE BRION CURRAN IS THE CHAIR OF THE MINNESOTA QUEER LEGISLATORS CAUCUS.

I'M SO HAPPY YOU'RE HERE.

THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME.

>> LET'S TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THIS.

IT'S A DISCREDITED PROCEDURE FOR WANT OF A BETTER WORD, I GUESS.

WHY -- WHY IS IT SEEN AS BEING SO DESTRUCTIVE TO A MINOR?

>> WELL, I THINK IT'S NOT ONLY DESTRUCTIVE TO A MINOR.

IT'S DESTRUCTIVE TO ANYONE.

SO WHAT CONVERSION THERAPY OR ANY SORT OF OTHER TERMINOLOGY THAT SOMEONE MAY WANT TO USE FOR IT, I'VE DESCRIBED IT AS ABUSE BEFORE.

YOU KNOW, IT'S A SERIOUS THING TO TRY TO FORCE SOMEONE TO BE SOMEONE OR SOMETHING THAT THEY'RE JUST NOT.

AND WHAT WE SEE IN CHILDREN AND VULNERABLE PEOPLE IS THAT WHEN THEY ARE EXPOSED TO SO-CALLED CONVERSION THERAPY, IT CREATES THIS EVEN MORE INTERNAL CONFLICT WITH THE PERSON ALREADY TRYING TO COME TO TERMS WITH WHO THEY ARE AND SEEKING OUT COMFORT.

AND INSTEAD, THERE ARE EFFORTS TO TURN THE PERSON AWAY FROM WHO THEY TRULY ARE.

AND FEEL SOME SHAME ABOUT WHO THEY ARE.

IT'S DESTRUCTIVE AND IT LEADS TO SIGNIFICANT INCREASES IN LEVELS OF DEPRESSION AND SUICIDE AMONG OUR YOUTH.

>> Cathy: THERE'S GOING TO BE SOME FOLKS WHO SAY, LOOK, THIS IS STILL GOING ON.

I MEAN, IT'S KIND OF PREIVE LEACHT OUT IN THE LEACHT OUT INPREVALENTOUT IN THE ARE COACHES AND RELIGIOUS FOLKS WHO ARE HAVING CONVERSATIONS WITH YOUNG PEOPLE?

ISN'T THAT OKAY TO HAVE CONVERSATIONS ABOUT ONE'S GENDER OR SEXUALITY?

>> YEAH, SO I THINK THERE'S A DEFINITE DISTINCTION BETWEEN WHAT'S CONSIDERED CONVERSION THERAPY OR WHAT'S CONSIDERED A PRACTICE THAT SOMEBODY IS OFFERING TO SOMEONE OR A SERVICE THAT SOMEONE IS SEEKING OUT VERSUS HAVING CONVERSATIONS ABOUT WHO SOMEBODY IS AS A PERSON, HOW THEY MIGHT FEEL PERSONALLY ABOUT WHO THEY ARE, THAT'S A VERY DIFFERENT THING.

WHEN THE COURT STRUCK DOWN COLORADO'S LAW, THEY WERE INDICATING THAT CONVERSION THERAPY OR TALK THERAPY IS EQUAL TO THE FREEDOM OF SPEECH.

AND I DON'T KNOW THAT WE HAVE ANY OTHER MEDICAL PRACTICE THAT WE WOULD SAY THAT IT'S FREEDOM OF SPEECH AND NOT HOLD SOMEBODY ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE POTENTIAL HARM THAT THEY'RE CAUSING SOMEBODY.

>> Eric: WHAT'S THE POSSIBLE EFFECT THAT THE COLORADO CASE MIGHT HAVE ON MINNESOTA?

>> YEAH, SO HERE IN MINNESOTA, OUR LAWS ARE NEARLY IDENTICAL TO THE STATE OF COLORADO.

THE GOOD NEWS ABOUT THE SUPREME COURT'S DECISION IS IT DOESN'T FULLY REVERSE EVERYTHING SURROUNDING THE CONVERSION THERAPY BAN THAT WAS PASSED IN THE STATE OF MINNESOTA.

AND OTHER STATES.

WHAT IT DOES O IS REVERSE SOME OF THE WORK E'VE DONE AROUND SPECIFICALLY WHAT THEY CALL TALK THERAPY.

SO ANY SORT OF PHYSICAL EXPOSURE THAT PEOPLE MIGHT HAVE OR SOME OF THE HORRIBLE THINGS YOU MAY HAVE HEARD OF, LIKE, SHOCK THERAPY AND THINGS LIKE THAT, STILL VERY MUCH ILLEGAL IN THE STATE OF MINNESOTA.

WHAT WE'RE SPECIFICALLY TALKING ABOUT NOW IS THAT THERE MAY BE MORE ACCESS FOR PEOPLE TO RECEIVE SERVICE CALLED THERAPY WHERE THEY'RE SORT OF TALKED OUT OF BEING QUEER OR TRANS.

>> Cathy: YOU KNOW, THE DECISION, GETTING BACK TO THE SUPREME COURT DECISION, IT WAS 8 TO 1.

DID THAT SURPRISE YOU?

>> I FIND IT VERY SURPRISING.

I FIND IT ALARMING, BUT I ALSO DON'T FIND IT TERRIBLY SURPRISING, UNFORTUNATELY, IN THE POLITICAL ENVIRONMENT THAT WE'RE IN.

I THINK WE SEE A FEDERAL ADMINISTRATION WHO FALLS WOEFULLY SHORT WHEN IT COMES TO BEING KNOWLEDGEABLE ABOUT HEALTHCARE IN THE UNITED STATES.

AND THEY'VE MADE A LOT OF MISSTEPS ALONG THE WAY IN MANAGING HEALTHCARE ACROSS THE UNITED STATES.

AND I THINK THE SUPREME COURT HAS BEEN FOLLOWING SUIT WITH THE FEDERAL ADMINISTRATION.

AND THAT'S ABSOLUTELY SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO KEEP WATCH ON.

>> Eric: HOW IS THIS BEING ENFORCED IN THE MINNESOTA LEVEL?

>> SO A NEW RULING OF COURSE, HERE IN MINNESOTA -- >> Eric: BUT SINCE 2023, HOW IS IT BEING ENFORCED IN THIS STATE?

>> SO THE PRACTICE IS BANNED.

SO PEOPLE CAN'T -- PEOPLE CAN'T ACCESS ANYTHING HAT WOULD HAVE BEEN ADVERTISED AS CONVERSION TYPE THERAPY, TALK THERAPY, ANY SORT OF PHYSICAL, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, WHAT I CALL ABUSE BUT OTHERS CALL THERAPY TO TRY TO CONVERT SOMEBODY INTO SOMETHING THEY'RE NOT.

IT'S JUST SIMPLY BEEN BANNED AS A SERVICE THAT YOU CAN NO LONGER SEEK OUT FOR YOUTH AND VULNERABLE PEOPLE.

>> Eric: SO SOMEBODY WANTED TO REINSTATE THE PRACTICE IN MINNESOTA, THEY WOULD USE THE SUPREME COURT RULING IN WHAT WAY, I WONDER?

>> THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE USED IN THE WAY, AGAIN, THAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT TALK THERAPY.

>> Eric: OKAY.

>> AND I WOULD JUST SAY THAT -- I THINK A MOVE LIKE THAT FROM THE SUPREME COURT REALLY DISCREDITS THE MEDICAL PRACTICE OF THERAPY AND WHAT IT IS AND WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TRYING TO HELP PEOPLE SRT SRSORT OF REPROGRAM THEIR BRAIN IN A HEALTHY WAY TO HELP DEAL WITH THINGS ON A DAY-TO-DAY BASIS, THAT'S WHAT THERAPY IS.

IT'S NOT ABOUT SWAYING PEOPLE.

AND I THINK IN THE CONTEXT OF GENDER AFFIRMING CARE, YOU KNOW, THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS MEDICALLY NECESSARY.

THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS SAFE, THAT IS PROVEN, THAT WE SHOULD BE PROVIDING FOR PEOPLE.

>> Eri